Real-World Learning: How to Build Academic Success and Essential Life Skills at Home

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Welcome to the Where Parents Talk podcast. We help grow better parents through science, evidence and the lived experience of other parents.

Learn how to better navigate the mental and physical health of your tween teen or young adult through proven expert advice. Here's your host, Lianne Castelino.

Welcome to Where Parents Talk. My name is Lianne Castelino. Our guest today is an educator and an entrepreneur.

Amelie Drouin is the founder of Anywhere Learning, which helps families use real world learning to help kids build academic and life skills at the same time. She is a former classroom teacher and a mother of two. Amelie joins us today from Nelson, British Columbia. Thank you so much for making the time.

Hi, Lian. Nice to meet you. Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure.

It's a very interesting conversation we're about to have because you have spent 15 years in a classroom before you founded Anywhere Learning.

What was the moment, or maybe it was a series of moments that made you realize that something important was missing from the ways that we educate children today?

Yeah, I think it wasn't like a particular moment. It kind of built up over the year, the years. It became more and more difficult to teach the kids.

And like, near the end, I was kind of spending a big chunk of the day just getting the kids ready to learn, like, example, teaching them how to start something without being told every step or how to handle a little frustration or how to focus and how to work out a problem with a friend. So it becomes really, really hard because we had to teach those basic skills on top of the full curriculum that we were meant to teach.

And when those basic skills are missing, the schoolwork suffers too, actually. So everything slows down, but you still have to, you know, you still have to met the curriculum and, like, the demands.

And so I kind of got burned out by it. And I think a lot of teachers are right now.

How many years ago was that, Emily, that you stepped out of the classroom?

Last year. So it's been a year now. So I, yeah, I, I stepped out of the classroom. I tear. I took a year off and I went traveling with my family.

So you're watching this happen over the 15 years. You're taking it in, you're observing these behaviors. What then led you to creating Anywhere Learning?

Like, what, what was it that you were trying to address and how did you come up with the programming that you have?

Yeah, so when I was homeschooling my kids while traveling, I really noticed what the problem was about the basic skills, the life skills. And so, and at first, I Did a little bit what I did in the classroom, so worksheets and, you know.

But then I realized that kids are more engaged when they do real world learning. They would be more motivated by it, they would be more interesting and it would stick more.

Like, it would be more meaningful and it would stick more and more. Could apply the learning in other different situations. So I started to put all my activities on paper.

And then I was like, might as well help other families. They're there. And I'm a pretty creative person with great ideas and always been that's something that people told or told me.

One of my great skill is. So I put that online and I said, well, I might as well help people.

And yeah, not only like homeschool parents, but every parents that wants to do a little bit more at home.

So give us an example of what that looks like. You talk about homeschooling your children. You were traveling at the time. I guess you used your own kids as sort of guinea pigs, right?

In terms of the programming that you came up with, what does that look like?

Yeah. So first of all, I asked them, what are you interested in? What do you want to learn about?

And you get to know your kids even more when you're with them full time. So we put the books away and then we focused on, yeah, start with what they were interested in and then we build up around it.

So, example, my daughter is into art. Like, she's into music and drama.

And so for her, it was all about learning something, but making it a song or doing like a drama show or even she did interviews with us, like dad and mom and her brother, about where we were and what we were learning about the country and the culture. And then she would add some ads to it and that would make it her own. But during this, she wouldn't even notice that she was learning.

She was writing, she was reading, she was doing math, she was doing social studies and science, all in the same real world project. So that's just an example of it. Or like we were climbing up to a volcano and my son asked me why the water was so green.

And I didn't have any clue about it. So I'm like, let's research it together. And then he made a. Yeah, a little.

Not a podcast, but a little video explaining to other people what it was and what. What was the phenomenon about that? And because he likes to. He likes technology. Of course he does. So, yeah, so that's what it looks like.

And the activity I created two are really flex and adaptable. You can do the same activity with little kids and big kids.

So the whole family can do it together, but with different, different, I would say different levels.

If you were to summarize everything that you've learned about how children learn best in one sentence, what would that be?

I think it would be kids learn best by doing real things that matter to them, where the academics and the life skills grow together.

So in the example of your son and the volcano that you just shared, can you take us through what are the life skills that he's learning? You know, you talked about researching it with him, but what are some of the life skills that he's learning in that, in that example,.

That particular example, like how, how to research. That's probably one of the most important one these days. How to know it's. It's true.

Like it's real information, but also problem solving to figure out. Like, it, it doesn't always work at like how you want it to work. So there's problem solving involved, there's communication involved.

Because you did like a video. Who is this video addressed to? So how to talk to different kind of people. Also like reading, writing, of course. Yeah.

So then, as both a teacher and a parent, how have your children changed or have they changed your thinking about education in the ways that your time in the classroom never did or never could?

Yeah. So teaching, show me the problem and then my. My own kids show me the answer.

So in a classroom, like full of kids, like 30 kids in average, you're always moving, moving. You can't never really just let one kid dig into something as long as they want. Right. That's how it's set up.

So.

And at home, I finally saw what happens when you give kids time. You give them a real job and space to be curious, really. So they learn.

They learn more from planning a trip or running like a little project than from any worksheet. Worksheet, sorry. On the same topic.

Yeah.

You know, it's so interesting to hear you talk about how we should be thinking about academics and life skills on the same track as opposed to separately. But the question then becomes, how did we get here? Like, why do you think we've come to see them being treated as separate entities?

Yeah. I think it's mostly because that's how school is set up. Like, everything is split into subjects and into little time slot with a bell.

But real life doesn't work that way. Like, nothing you do at home comes with a. A label that says math or science or, you know, we keep them separate.

Then when we do that, two things goes wrong. The kids, they don't understand the why we do that. So they're going to ask when am I ever going to use that? That's a fair question.

And then also they miss the chance to build both at once, which is really the natural way it happens. Yeah. And then, yeah, in school we, we, we have to teach a curriculum.

And so life skills tends to, they tend to take like, you know, the side or get squeezed out of the day.

What age of child should a parent be looking at targeting with teaching academic and life skills together? What, what grades are we talking about here? When should it start?

I think it should start from, from when they're little, little at home.

I think, I think like one problem that we have in schools right now is due from what we're doing at home before school happens, you know, and what I mean by that is we're in a society right now where kids are over scheduled and they're also over protected. And that's one of the big reason why they can't build those life skills.

They don't get the space and the time to build those life skills that will help them later in school. Help them to learn later in school.

So yeah, you know, you talked about the, the examples during your trip.

Are there any other ordinary, everyday examples from daily family life that you know, an activity that could really help with teaching both academics and life skills at the same time?

Yeah, the easy one would be cooking. So let's say we're, we want to cook a meal from like from start to finish. So there's reading and writing.

If you want to find a recipe on, let's say you find a recipe in a book or online, you need to read. Also after that you need to write for the grocery list. And after that, oh, the recipe says it's for two portions, but we want to double it.

So you have fractions right there. What are we going to do like multiplying or dividing flat fractions. Also getting a few things ready at the same time.

That's planning and timing, tasting it and fixing it. You know, that's problem solving right there. And so yeah, and we do it three times a day at home.

So it's not something that you have to add to your plate. It's something that's already there in your plate. You just need to take a little bit of time to include your kids in it.

And so they are kind of learning life skills right beside you. And, and of course I did it and I still do it. Sometimes it's like, I don't, we don't have time, I'll do it. It's going to be faster.

Or sometimes it's like, oh, I'll do it for you because it's safer. But we really have to be cautious about that and let them fail, let them try it. That's where the learning is. Really?

Yeah, absolutely.

Many parents have been conditioned for a long time to want to see their kids sitting down, doing homework, you know, doing worksheets, all the things that we associate with school. Otherwise those parents, parents feel that their kids are falling behind.

So how do you, as a teacher, as a parent, challenge that mindset without dismissing the importance of academics?

Yeah, that's a hard one because that's how we learn. That's how it's been for decades and years. Like, that's, that's what we know really. Right. And I want to know, I'm not against worksheets.

Worksheets, they can be good. They can help a kid understand a concept, like at the start of it. But then it can't stop there. It can't only be only worksheets.

The idea that it's going to really stick when they use it in real life. So that's also where the meaning comes from and the motivation, like I said.

So it's going to be more meaningful for them and they'll want to do more and they'll understand it and they'll be more curious about it. So let's say a worksheet, a worksheet about money is a fine start. Like there's a concept there that we learn, that we can learn.

But then a kids who's going to plan a party, let's say a little party or get together is going to learn more and like you have this budget and you need to do this and you need to do that and oh, I want to buy this, but you know, you need to trade it for something more useful or you know, it's going to make it more real for them. And that's how it's going to click. Really. So worksheet, worksheets are like an open door. And then real life, it what makes it stick after.

Take us through Emily, if you could. What does real world learning look and how does it look differently for let's say a six year old who's in grade one versus a 14 year old.

So a teenager.

Yeah. So the thing is, it could be the exact same question or the exact same moment.

It doesn't have to be a different activity, it just it needs a different question. So simple example, a puddle.

So a six year old's gonna see a puddle, gonna jump in it and we're gonna ask him like why does it splash or what happened? And it's gonna be caused an effect. You know, it's super simple.

A 10 year old, you're going to look at how fast it dries versus what, why this one doesn't dry because it's in the shade. Like that's an experiment right there. That is a simple, like a simple experiment but still an experiment.

And a teenager you can track, you can track and measure how fast it's going to shrink. So you have like data right there. It's really like. So it doesn't have to be something complicated. It just needs a different question.

Along those lines.

Is there an everyday chore or responsibility that parents often do for their children that actually really represents very rich learning opportunities?

There's a lot, you know, like just talking for them. We, we usually do that. Like you go in a restaurant or you go to an appointment just talking for them. That's a real life skills that they can.

It's easy for us to just let them do the talking. And even if it's uncomfortable and it's not perfect, they're learning. Or laundry.

Maybe not doing the laundry, but after that you can fold your laundry and put it away. Doesn't have to be perfect. Like yours can be. Well fold if you want to but it doesn't matter for them.

Like they're learning that little skills or even cooking like just cut something or wash the dishes with me. So it's, it's really like everything that we do for them we need to think about like they could do it.

It's just, it's not going to be the way that we want it to be for sure. And also we need to step back, let them do it without any advice or explanation and make sure that they fail at it. Sometimes it's hard.

It's funny to say that it that way but like that's how they're gonna learn. So packing their bag to go to school. Is it really like is it, is it, is it.

It's not gonna matter if they, they forget their water bottle but that's how they're gonna remember how like to bring it the next day. You know there's always some water fountain at school where I could drink of like they're not gonna let the kid be super thirsty or whatever.

So like those little things even make their snacks. Like okay, you might, it might be Hungry today, but it'll learn.

And tomorrow put more or, you know, so it's really to be intentional about it and just think what. What my kid could do right now, today, that I won't do for him or her, and that he can learn from it.

On that point. You're an educator. Many parents aren't educators. How can they tell if their child is actually learning through these everyday activities?

Yeah.

So in school, like grades or a picture of what the kid can do right now in one moment where life skills doesn't work that way, but you're going to see that it's working when they're going to use that skill when you didn't ask them to, you know, so when they're going to help a sibling by example, doing this thing or explaining something to them, or if the question they're going to ask today is better than the question they asked a month ago, or if they're gonna set up, step up. Sorry. Like, at a moment where you didn't ask them to. And I have a great example for that.

I was sick a while ago and not feeling super well, and I started making dinner, and my son asked me, are you okay, Mom? Like, because maybe I was a bit rude to him. I think that's what it was. And I was like, no, you know what? I'm not okay.

I'm sick, I'm tired, that I had a long day, and now I have to make dinner. And so he told me, I'm going to help, Mom. I'm going to make dinner tonight.

And his sister, she heard a conversation and she came and she was, I'm going to help, too, Mom. Go take a shower and relax. We're going to make dinner. And it was something simple, but still.

So I went upstairs, took a shower, and when I came back, dinner was ready and the whole kitchen was clean. Like, they did the dishes, they wiped the countertops, and so that's.

That's when, you know, like, they'll learn something or they're getting somewhere with the life skills. So, no, it's not going to be on the report card, but you're gonna know and when they're gonna start calling themselves to make appointments.

But it's funny because kids these days, they don't know how to talk on a phone. So when you start, it's so awkward and weird, but then it gets. It get natural and, you know, it's. It's sticking.

Yeah. If they're not exposed to these things, how are they ever going to learn? Right? So, yeah, definitely.

Emily you also talk about boredom as being beneficial. Explain what you mean by that.

Like I said earlier, kids, the kids today are overstimulated in a sense that they don't really know boredom anymore. Everything is instant. Like, the TV is like, we're gonna register, register them in activities. And like, they don't have time to be bored anymore.

And they're losing their creativity mostly by not being bored.

When a kid is bored, that empty space is where they start to come up with ideas and invent stuff and create stuff and start to having fun and even like learning about themselves. Really. Like so, yeah, so that's, that's why we have to again, be intentional about making sure our kids, they know how to be bored.

And yes, that's an uncomfortable feeling. They don't like it. But if you stick with it, it's gonna get easier and easier and easier.

But for now, like, even like you, we see it every day in restaurants. Kids, they have a tablet or screen or screen of any sort, or toys like, or books, or just let them be bored, like in waiting rooms, in cars. Yeah.

How can a parent together, even together at home, like between siblings, just, yeah. Smile and say, great, great, you're bored. Be bored. Yeah. They'll fight back for sure.

And sometimes even for us, like you, you get that, that, that guilt, A little guilt. Oh, they're not doing anything. Maybe I should, like, do something with them or for them or give ideas. Nope.

Along those lines, then how can a parent differentiate, distinguish between healthy boredom in their child and a child who is disengaged or checking out?

Yeah. This matters because, like, I'm not telling parents to ignore a kid who's struggling. Healthy boredom is restless.

They complain, they fidget, and then given some space, they're going to drift into players. Something's going to come out of that boredom. But this engagement is different. Like, it's flat. There's no spark for anything.

And they pull away from the, the things that they used to love. So boredom's gonna lead somewhere. This engagement doesn't. You know what I mean? And if that flatness sticks, like, sticks around, that's.

That's the one to pay attention to and maybe seek some help with or. Yeah.

So, you know, one of the things that a lot of parents will be asking is where does technology fit into all of this? Can technology complement real world learning or does it compete with it?

You can do both, really. And that's a whole other subject, technology these days. But it can be a great tool. But it can also be like a Bad replacement.

And what I mean by that is what I always say. It's good when it's more creating and less consuming.

The simple question is, is my kid using the screen right now to make something, to do something, or is just like watching and scrolling? If it's just watching and scrolling, it competes.

If it's like making something or doing something now, like it can be, it can work together with, with academics and life skills. Really? Yeah. So if you're.

Yeah, that, that's what it is really like if they're looking up something up or building, building something, filming something, talking to a real person, that helps. But if the screen becomes the only thing they do, it starts to take the place of real life, really.

We've talked about how you spent the majority of your career as an educator in a classroom. You have chosen homeschool your children. You're now an entrepreneur in that education space.

What would you change, if anything, about the way kids are taught in school today for those parents who maybe can't home the homeschool their children?

Yeah, that's a good question. What I would change is I would make sure that, yeah, I would, I would make more real life learning actually in the classroom and like not separate.

Like math is math and science. And science and maybe more work more as project based learning or interest based learning with the, the students.

And what I mean by that is like I said, creativity, all the skills that are not going to be replaced by a computer, really. Creativity, solving problems, adapting when things change, sticking with something hard, that's, that's a hard one today.

Working together with other people, communication, communicating. Because these days they're mostly on their phone, texting.

So in school it's important to talk, to communicate and also managing yourself, like controlling your emotion. All that. Yeah, all that.

So I would make sure we focus more on these skills and maybe let go of some other or concepts or that are not as relevant today.

What would you say, Emily, that you have learned about your own children, how they learn and the difference between, you know, when they were going to school versus you homeschooling them. What does that change look like?

Yeah, like I said earlier, it's more like when they get to choose like what they're going to learn about or how they're going to present that learning to me like at the end, not even like they don't feel like they're even learning or working.

It becomes like fun and engaging and it's something that it put, they put their heart in and it becomes so fun to see and watch, like the sparkle and the curiosity and in a sense, it's like the love of learning. Yeah.

Which in school sometimes it could be like just watching the clock and asking yourself when it's going to be done, you know, So I think that's, that's, that's what I learned the most about, about them. Yeah.

We only have about a minute left, but I did want to ask you what is one small change that a parent can make in their own home today that could make room for both academic learning and real life learning and life skills learning at the same time?

Yeah. So what I would like to say is that you don't have to choose between a smart kid and a capable one.

And also that you don't have, or you don't need a curriculum or a teaching degree to do that at home either. You just have to be intentional about it and see the learning. Like the learning is everywhere. That's, that's why I learned.

I call my business anywhere learning, actually. But you just be intentional about it and just step back a little bit.

We're all like stretched thin and we don't want to add to our plate, but we actually can just give it a little bit more to our kids. They're more capable than we think they are. And I think it might, the reason might be how childhood is right now, but they are more capable.

And as soon as you're going to let your kid take a little bit more responsibilities or do a little bit more, you're going to see that they, they're capable of. And that's easy. Just. Yeah. Take a little small thing today.

Could be, like I said, laundry or even just, yeah, lunch or packing their bags or something small and start from there and make it go bigger. And they like to take responsibilities, they like to feel that they're important and they're helping the family too.

And then the, the learning, the academics, it's gonna come. Like, you just have to see it. Like when they're doing, cooking with you, they're reading, they're writing.

If they wanna, they wanna have a friend over like a, a play date. Okay. But you're gonna plan, you're going to plan it. Who, what. When you're going to call your friend, you're going to, you know.

Yeah.

Just. Sorry.

Yeah. No, you've certainly given us a lot to think about, and it's never too late to start.

Emily Dru, Founder of Anywhere Learning and Educator, thank you so much for your time and your insight today.

Thank you so much for having me.

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